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	<title>Comments on: Conference Notes: Community and what is REALLY Next (hint: I don&#8217;t know)</title>
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	<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/</link>
	<description>a world uncommon</description>
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		<title>By: Robert Franklin</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-2428</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Franklin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Feb 2007 15:51:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-2428</guid>
		<description>It was a pleasure meeting you at the conference.  I enjoyed your presentation on communities and thought it complimented the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.threadless.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Threadless&lt;/a&gt; presentation very nicely.  Your presentation certainly got me buzzing that numbers are not the most important thing when measuring the health of a community, but fun and awesomeness are!

I would love to be part of your community day that is passionate about making a difference and being awesome.  Let me know how I can help.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was a pleasure meeting you at the conference.  I enjoyed your presentation on communities and thought it complimented the <a href="http://www.threadless.com" rel="nofollow">Threadless</a> presentation very nicely.  Your presentation certainly got me buzzing that numbers are not the most important thing when measuring the health of a community, but fun and awesomeness are!</p>
<p>I would love to be part of your community day that is passionate about making a difference and being awesome.  Let me know how I can help.</p>
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		<title>By: noah kagan</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-2037</link>
		<dc:creator>noah kagan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:08:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thank you so much for speaking! I know I had fun coordinating possibly the one and only Community Next.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you so much for speaking! I know I had fun coordinating possibly the one and only Community Next.</p>
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		<title>By: tish grier</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1324</link>
		<dc:creator>tish grier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 18:18:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1324</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;How the hell do I balance my desire to stay grassroots and true to my own message with starting to be part of these conferences and organizations that promote a level of community engagement that I rail against? Do I REALLY see my presence there as helpful? As the ‘voice of reason’ or some other unlikely bull? Or am I merely a token female/rogue?&lt;/i&gt;

Sometimes we first have to define for ourselves the type of woman we want to be.  That type of woman may not fit any particular feminist or old school paradigm.  The type of women we are may be someone we never knew...nor could imagine

So, nothing wrong w/being the token female.  all depends on how you do it and if you are comfortable with that role. I have my own ways...which right now I&#039;m comfortable with (as I&#039;m not the greatest public speaker.  I&#039;m better at &quot;holding court.&quot;)

To stay grassroots:  mingle with grassroots.  never forget about the community you live in and get involved there too--lots of communities have grassroots orgs that need volunteers.  I&#039;m an assoc. director of a local film festival and also doing some press release writing for a small local arts org and possibly something w/ a streaming radio station--even though I still seem to show up as a &quot;presence&quot; at cons (12 total in 18 months--will be at Beyond Broadcast at MIT this weekend with mini entorage.) 

How much you need to be grassroots, and how much you need to speak to them, and be understood, will teach you a lot.

Always remember, too, that water will seek its own level.  You will go as far as you are able, then you will stumble and things will even out.  You will, in time, learn to balance making money with your ideals.  One may win over the other, but only time will tell you the answer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>How the hell do I balance my desire to stay grassroots and true to my own message with starting to be part of these conferences and organizations that promote a level of community engagement that I rail against? Do I REALLY see my presence there as helpful? As the ‘voice of reason’ or some other unlikely bull? Or am I merely a token female/rogue?</i></p>
<p>Sometimes we first have to define for ourselves the type of woman we want to be.  That type of woman may not fit any particular feminist or old school paradigm.  The type of women we are may be someone we never knew&#8230;nor could imagine</p>
<p>So, nothing wrong w/being the token female.  all depends on how you do it and if you are comfortable with that role. I have my own ways&#8230;which right now I&#8217;m comfortable with (as I&#8217;m not the greatest public speaker.  I&#8217;m better at &#8220;holding court.&#8221;)</p>
<p>To stay grassroots:  mingle with grassroots.  never forget about the community you live in and get involved there too&#8211;lots of communities have grassroots orgs that need volunteers.  I&#8217;m an assoc. director of a local film festival and also doing some press release writing for a small local arts org and possibly something w/ a streaming radio station&#8211;even though I still seem to show up as a &#8220;presence&#8221; at cons (12 total in 18 months&#8211;will be at Beyond Broadcast at MIT this weekend with mini entorage.) </p>
<p>How much you need to be grassroots, and how much you need to speak to them, and be understood, will teach you a lot.</p>
<p>Always remember, too, that water will seek its own level.  You will go as far as you are able, then you will stumble and things will even out.  You will, in time, learn to balance making money with your ideals.  One may win over the other, but only time will tell you the answer.</p>
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		<title>By: Jake McKee</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1292</link>
		<dc:creator>Jake McKee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:15:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1292</guid>
		<description>Damon, I have a feeling you&#039;ll really hate this...

http://www.communityguy.com/sites/doingtoday/index.cfm/id/Bandwagon_has_arrived_Please

Lord knows I do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Damon, I have a feeling you&#8217;ll really hate this&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.communityguy.com/sites/doingtoday/index.cfm/id/Bandwagon_has_arrived_Please" rel="nofollow">http://www.communityguy.com/sites/doingtoday/index.cfm/id/Bandwagon_has_arrived_Please</a></p>
<p>Lord knows I do.</p>
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		<title>By: Damon Billian</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1237</link>
		<dc:creator>Damon Billian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 08:01:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1237</guid>
		<description>&quot;As for “making money from community”, I think that is the wrong approach; rather, why not make a community where members can, each at their own abilities, have opportunity [to make money or otherwise]? Think about the framing difference.&quot;

I think this already happens to a large degree (people share business tips, ideas, etc. without the company framing it). A very solid example of this can be found on the eBay boards. But I can assure you that the company has a community because they can learn from them as well, which helps the company make money and address business issues.

Optimal: Companies wouldn&#039;t use companies solely for money.
Practical: Companies will &quot;leverage&quot; community in some way; a company has to dedicate resources to support a community, after all (customer support, moderation, providing the software platform(s). I&#039;ve rarely seen a company do something because it is &quot;the right thing to do&quot; w/o some sort of value going back to the company (feedback, loyalty, retention, etc.).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;As for “making money from community”, I think that is the wrong approach; rather, why not make a community where members can, each at their own abilities, have opportunity [to make money or otherwise]? Think about the framing difference.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think this already happens to a large degree (people share business tips, ideas, etc. without the company framing it). A very solid example of this can be found on the eBay boards. But I can assure you that the company has a community because they can learn from them as well, which helps the company make money and address business issues.</p>
<p>Optimal: Companies wouldn&#8217;t use companies solely for money.<br />
Practical: Companies will &#8220;leverage&#8221; community in some way; a company has to dedicate resources to support a community, after all (customer support, moderation, providing the software platform(s). I&#8217;ve rarely seen a company do something because it is &#8220;the right thing to do&#8221; w/o some sort of value going back to the company (feedback, loyalty, retention, etc.).</p>
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		<title>By: Joey</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1232</link>
		<dc:creator>Joey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Feb 2007 05:23:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1232</guid>
		<description>Your own, honest, struggle on the subject of feminism may indicate that society at large has the same confusion. Personally, I think the under 30 generations no longer give a toot about what your gender is but greatly appreciate any body parts you might expose ;) Oh wait, the later may have always been true! 

Be yourself; but also make sure your arguments are well structured and make sense. A study of anthropology might actually help you frame your thoughts on cyberspace communities; just keep in mind that while the same positive, touchy feely, aspects of real world communities also apply to cyber ones (common need, cause, purpose,  group-likeness, individual empowerment, identification, etc.); so do the negative, nasty and destructive aspects (common need, cause, purpose, group-likeness, individual empowerment, identification, etc.) .... 

We are social animals and we (general population) hardly understand our own group needs; though, there is a lot of material written on the subject of social dynamics.

I am weary of &quot;community&quot; because I&#039;ve seen how negative it always ends up; but I also know from my own self-imposed hermitness (a near death hearth attack and total disappointment in all people -- both of which I&#039;m still recovering from) that it is near impossible to isolate oneself without self destruction. 

Whatever you do, try to keep in mind that &quot;community&quot; and &quot;sacredness&quot; aren&#039;t the same thing.

As for &quot;making money from community&quot;, I think that is the wrong approach; rather, why not make a community where members can, each at their own abilities, have opportunity [to make money or otherwise]? Think about the framing difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your own, honest, struggle on the subject of feminism may indicate that society at large has the same confusion. Personally, I think the under 30 generations no longer give a toot about what your gender is but greatly appreciate any body parts you might expose <img src='http://www.horsepigcow.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  Oh wait, the later may have always been true! </p>
<p>Be yourself; but also make sure your arguments are well structured and make sense. A study of anthropology might actually help you frame your thoughts on cyberspace communities; just keep in mind that while the same positive, touchy feely, aspects of real world communities also apply to cyber ones (common need, cause, purpose,  group-likeness, individual empowerment, identification, etc.); so do the negative, nasty and destructive aspects (common need, cause, purpose, group-likeness, individual empowerment, identification, etc.) &#8230;. </p>
<p>We are social animals and we (general population) hardly understand our own group needs; though, there is a lot of material written on the subject of social dynamics.</p>
<p>I am weary of &#8220;community&#8221; because I&#8217;ve seen how negative it always ends up; but I also know from my own self-imposed hermitness (a near death hearth attack and total disappointment in all people &#8212; both of which I&#8217;m still recovering from) that it is near impossible to isolate oneself without self destruction. </p>
<p>Whatever you do, try to keep in mind that &#8220;community&#8221; and &#8220;sacredness&#8221; aren&#8217;t the same thing.</p>
<p>As for &#8220;making money from community&#8221;, I think that is the wrong approach; rather, why not make a community where members can, each at their own abilities, have opportunity [to make money or otherwise]? Think about the framing difference.</p>
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		<title>By: On community... : A touch of love...</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1210</link>
		<dc:creator>On community... : A touch of love...</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1210</guid>
		<description>[...] A touch of love... Published 14 February 07 08:18 AM I love recap posts. For those of us who weren&#039;t able to attend the CommunityNext summit, I found recaps by Anastasia, Lee and Tara quite useful. I personally find it helpful to see how others view the same content -- that alone makes it that much more insightful and authentic.  Loosely related...it was great to see folks point out that the community space is not at all monolithic and there are multiple community camps. On the one hand, you have those who more or less set out to build a community, and if money happens, then it&#039;s a good thing. Others set out with money as the primary driver (either making it or saving it) by using a community. As similar as these may sound, they represent two very different philosophies. To make things more complicated, sometimes you may encounter situations where the two different camps are working on the same project!  Having worked in both camps from time to time, I would like to suggest that there is yet another piece to this matrix -- the people who build the tools used in community. Think of this as the Belgium of the community space. It doesn&#039;t fit into either camp perfectly, and instead prefers to remain neutral, and flexible so it can benefit the masses. I don&#039;t believe I belong to any one camp, but rather I tend to float between, adapting to the needs and the circumstances of the day. If pressed though, I&#039;d say that I lean more towards the focus on the community first. What about you? What&#039;s your community philosophy?  Heh -- I just noticed that I started and ended this particular post with love -- explicitly in the first sentence, and implicitly in the last with philosophy. While I&#039;m at it, here&#039;s another loving post from the Windows Live QnA Team    by b2ix  Filed under: community [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] A touch of love&#8230; Published 14 February 07 08:18 AM I love recap posts. For those of us who weren&#8217;t able to attend the CommunityNext summit, I found recaps by Anastasia, Lee and Tara quite useful. I personally find it helpful to see how others view the same content &#8212; that alone makes it that much more insightful and authentic.  Loosely related&#8230;it was great to see folks point out that the community space is not at all monolithic and there are multiple community camps. On the one hand, you have those who more or less set out to build a community, and if money happens, then it&#8217;s a good thing. Others set out with money as the primary driver (either making it or saving it) by using a community. As similar as these may sound, they represent two very different philosophies. To make things more complicated, sometimes you may encounter situations where the two different camps are working on the same project!  Having worked in both camps from time to time, I would like to suggest that there is yet another piece to this matrix &#8212; the people who build the tools used in community. Think of this as the Belgium of the community space. It doesn&#8217;t fit into either camp perfectly, and instead prefers to remain neutral, and flexible so it can benefit the masses. I don&#8217;t believe I belong to any one camp, but rather I tend to float between, adapting to the needs and the circumstances of the day. If pressed though, I&#8217;d say that I lean more towards the focus on the community first. What about you? What&#8217;s your community philosophy?  Heh &#8212; I just noticed that I started and ended this particular post with love &#8212; explicitly in the first sentence, and implicitly in the last with philosophy. While I&#8217;m at it, here&#8217;s another loving post from the Windows Live QnA Team    by b2ix  Filed under: community [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Damon Billian</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1182</link>
		<dc:creator>Damon Billian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Feb 2007 23:25:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1182</guid>
		<description>I think the thing with community is to try and make it a &quot;customer first&quot; thing. I don&#039;t think there&#039;s a lot of harm in businesses trying to make money from &quot;community&quot; as long as they are genuine about what they&#039;re doing &amp; actually do something when conversing with a customer (getting feedback, etc.) 

Many of the bloggers that I read have self-interests at heart as well ; some have books that they sell, some are public (paid) speakers on these topics, etc. Does this cause a conflict of interest?  

What I don&#039;t like about the topic of community is that a lot of people out there promoting it probably haven&#039;t really engaged in communities as a customer advocate (fixing/identifying problems, communicating to customers, etc.). I also don&#039;t like how people are trying to break it down into something that can be strategized and/or something that requires an action plan.

Even if I don&#039;t always agree with what you say, I do have a great deal of respect for you trying to shake things up a little:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the thing with community is to try and make it a &#8220;customer first&#8221; thing. I don&#8217;t think there&#8217;s a lot of harm in businesses trying to make money from &#8220;community&#8221; as long as they are genuine about what they&#8217;re doing &amp; actually do something when conversing with a customer (getting feedback, etc.) </p>
<p>Many of the bloggers that I read have self-interests at heart as well ; some have books that they sell, some are public (paid) speakers on these topics, etc. Does this cause a conflict of interest?  </p>
<p>What I don&#8217;t like about the topic of community is that a lot of people out there promoting it probably haven&#8217;t really engaged in communities as a customer advocate (fixing/identifying problems, communicating to customers, etc.). I also don&#8217;t like how people are trying to break it down into something that can be strategized and/or something that requires an action plan.</p>
<p>Even if I don&#8217;t always agree with what you say, I do have a great deal of respect for you trying to shake things up a little:)</p>
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		<title>By: Nollind Whachell</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1177</link>
		<dc:creator>Nollind Whachell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Feb 2007 20:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1177</guid>
		<description>&quot;It’s difficult to balance both, but putting yourself firmly in one camp or the other can be divisive.&quot;

Hehe, picking an established side in a fight is easy. Trying to bring both sides together in mutual understanding and respect of their differences is what&#039;s hard. If we want to make the world a better place, we need to stop putting up walls between our differences and start building bridges between our commonalities. That&#039;s what I believe communities can and should do.

&quot;I love the whole “explorer” metaphor. Mind if I use that?&quot;

Not at all, primarily because I got the idea from somewhere else myself and I liked the feeling of it as well. I think it was either from Margaret J. Wheatley&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.margaretwheatley.com/findingourway.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Finding Our Way: Leadership For An Uncertain Time&lt;/a&gt; or David Holmgren&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.holmgren.com.au/html/Publications/Principles.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Permaculture: Principles &amp; Pathways Beyond Sustainability&lt;/a&gt;. Both are excellent books if you haven&#039;t read them yet. Even after reading them myself, I continually refer back to them as resource guides on community development.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It’s difficult to balance both, but putting yourself firmly in one camp or the other can be divisive.&#8221;</p>
<p>Hehe, picking an established side in a fight is easy. Trying to bring both sides together in mutual understanding and respect of their differences is what&#8217;s hard. If we want to make the world a better place, we need to stop putting up walls between our differences and start building bridges between our commonalities. That&#8217;s what I believe communities can and should do.</p>
<p>&#8220;I love the whole “explorer” metaphor. Mind if I use that?&#8221;</p>
<p>Not at all, primarily because I got the idea from somewhere else myself and I liked the feeling of it as well. I think it was either from Margaret J. Wheatley&#8217;s <a href="http://www.margaretwheatley.com/findingourway.html" rel="nofollow">Finding Our Way: Leadership For An Uncertain Time</a> or David Holmgren&#8217;s <a href="http://www.holmgren.com.au/html/Publications/Principles.html" rel="nofollow">Permaculture: Principles &amp; Pathways Beyond Sustainability</a>. Both are excellent books if you haven&#8217;t read them yet. Even after reading them myself, I continually refer back to them as resource guides on community development.</p>
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		<title>By: Tara Hunt</title>
		<link>http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/comment-page-1/#comment-1174</link>
		<dc:creator>Tara Hunt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Feb 2007 17:50:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.horsepigcow.com/2007/02/11/conference-notes-community-and-what-is-really-next-hint-i-dont-know/#comment-1174</guid>
		<description>Yay Nolind!

Man, it&#039;s awesome to hear that I&#039;m not the only one who is struggling with this (especially coming from you!). Like I said to Mark (above), I agree that it isn&#039;t one or the other. It&#039;s difficult to balance both, but putting yourself firmly in one camp or the other can be divisive.

I love the whole &quot;explorer&quot; metaphor. Mind if I use that? I&#039;m thinking of changing my blog bi-line...:)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yay Nolind!</p>
<p>Man, it&#8217;s awesome to hear that I&#8217;m not the only one who is struggling with this (especially coming from you!). Like I said to Mark (above), I agree that it isn&#8217;t one or the other. It&#8217;s difficult to balance both, but putting yourself firmly in one camp or the other can be divisive.</p>
<p>I love the whole &#8220;explorer&#8221; metaphor. Mind if I use that? I&#8217;m thinking of changing my blog bi-line&#8230;:)</p>
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